Dialogue between Prof. Medard Boss and Prof. Dongshick Rhee / THE SECOND INTERVIEW  
※ This verbatim record is the dialogue between the late Prof. Medard Boss and Prof. RHEE, which took place at June 12 (10:00-10:50 AM), and 15 (9:00-9:50 AM), 1976, on Zurich Zollicon, Swiss. Prof. RHEE visited Prof. Medard Boss after the attendance of the 10th International Congress of Psychotherapy held on Paris, France.
It's reprinted from Psychotherapy (精神治療) Vol. 6, No. 1, pp.30-43, 1992, Korean Academy of Psychotherapists, Seoul, Korea.

※ 이 대화록은 1976년 7월 이동식 선생이 Paris에서 개최된 IFMP 제 10차 International Congress of Psychotherapy에 참가후, 7월 12일(10:00-10:50 AM)과 7월 15일(9:00-9:50 AM), Swiss의 Zurich Zollikon에서 Medard Boss 교수를 방문하여 Boss 교수와 2회의 대화를 가졌던 녹음 tape를 풀어 적은 것이다. 이 대화 동안 경북대 교수로 당시 Swiss의 C.G. Jung Institute에 유학중이던 이죽내 교수도 동참하였다.
* 본 녹음 내용의 축어록 작성에는 경북의대 강석헌, 이죽내, 임효덕 교수와 서강대학교 생활상담실 최해림 선생, 미국인 Mrs. Marge Hoyle 씨가 참여하였다.


Dialogue between Prof. Medard Boss and Prof. Dongshick Rhee

THE SECOND INTERVIEW

Prof. Boss: Now I mean it is the most interesting paper and it should be published. The two approaches, Western & Eastern approach, I always have in mind how rigid and structured our people are. They are influenced by culture, by church, and everything else, and they have to a large extent, to repress their feelings, and to distantiate themselves (Prof. Rhee: Distanzierung) from everything that matters and from other human beings. They have to build in order to be able to exist at the heart of belief and to fight for their living, they have to build a hard shell around their heart. (Prof. Rhee: Schloss) And therefore the psychoanalysis also Daseinsanalysis first tries to destroy the shell and give them the courage to be their real and true self as a human being. So first we have to open them up to be able to engage themselves into the relationships with things and matters. It's just the opposite of detachment. (Prof. Rhee: It is attachment.) They first have to learn, and so I can honestly say that the way, the Eastern way, the Zen way or the meditation way has different ways from our Western way and only if the Western people become analyzed and/or by nature remain open, free of judgement, being able to be attached, then they can hope of their free will detach them again. So that's the Western way of psychotherapy and the Eastern way, Buddhism is also a kind of psychotherapy. They are not equivalent, not the same but here the Western people, Western psychoanalytic treatment has to come first. And then they can detach themselves again, out of their free will. Formerly they have to detach themselves by force, by meditation, not out of their own will and therefore I have seen in India, I have seen so many Western people who try to go into monasteries in India and do meditation before they have really destroyed the shell and then they become caricatures of human beings. So it's a kind of step in-between the two.
Untitled Document
Copyright(c) 2004 Korean Academy of psychotherapists. All rights reserved.
※ 심우도는 십우도(十牛圖), 목우도(牧牛圖)라고도 부르며 참선(參禪)에서의 각(覺)의 과정(過程)을 표현하고 있습니다.
그림은 송광사의 십우도 벽화입니다.